Suns center Deandre Ayton is playing in the Western Conference finals three years after being the first selection in the draft, but he tells Marc J. Spears of the Undefeated that most fans don’t see him as an elite player. Ayton had the highlight of his career Tuesday night when he dunked off an inbounds pass in the final second to give Phoenix a 2-0 series lead. It put him in the national spotlight after missing the playoffs during his first two NBA seasons.
“I still think they doubt me. I still think they don’t believe yet,” Ayton said. “I might be turning some heads with people that know basketball, like front-office types, and people that really know the game. I know I am probably stepping into the right direction. But I don’t think the world truly, truly sees that. But if I can win this whole thing, that is where I can get my reputation. That is where I can be a star.”
Although he has been effective since entering the league, Ayton has mostly been overshadowed — by Chris Paul and Devin Booker on the Suns and by Luka Doncic and Trae Young in his draft class. Ayton was suspended for 25 games during his second NBA season and has been criticized for a casual attitude, but he credits the arrival of coach Monty Williams and the success the team had after last year’s restart with turning that around.
“Winning was contagious and we added pieces like (Paul), Jae (Crowder), E’Twaun Moore, Langston Galloway and Torrey Craig,” Ayton said. “Those are guys who have been in the game and played at high levels like this. That is the best way I can think of how I turned my career into a positive one.”
There’s more from the Pacific Division:
- The Suns have listed Paul as probable for Thursday’s Game 3, tweets Marc Stein of The New York Times. Paul has missed the first two games of the series while in the league’s health and safety protocols, but he expects to receive clearance to play tomorrow.
- The Kings need more help than the draft can provide, so they should be aggressive about trying to get Ben Simmons from the Sixers, contends Jason Jones of The Athletic. He suggests offering Buddy Hield or Marvin Bagley III along with the No. 9 pick.
- The Warriors have two selections in this year’s lottery, and president of basketball operations Bob Myers won’t say if he plans to hold onto both of them, per Kendra Andrews of NBC Sports. Golden State already has one development project in center James Wiseman and may not have room for two rookies as it hopes to get back into title contention. “We’re not trying to develop players at the risk of losing,” Myers said. “We’re not going to develop and have it cost us games. That’s not the plan.”
Oh, Hell No !! We do Not need that under achiever. Save the Money and go after someone we need and that’s good. Stop getting everyone else’s Rejects !! And How in the Hell do you fit his $31m per yr Salary into our line up when we are already bumping the Salary Cap !!
The Kings would be a team that goes hard after Ben, it’s in their nature.
I’m a kings fan but that the only real way we gonna get anybody good weather it Simmons or any other superstar
Kings have no assets to get anyone better than Simmons
Nope.
– D. Fox
Not true. Hield and Holmes can get them Porzingis.
Holmes is a UFA !! You can Not trade a FA !! Send them Bagless !!
He’s absolutely right he’s not a star he’s pretty decent but that’s his ceiling.
That could be a brilliant suggestion for Simmons. It’s clear that he wilted under the playoff pressure, so sending him to a team that is virtually guaranteed to miss the playoffs most years could be great. He could end up as the Mike Trout of the NBA. Great regular season numbers with no playoff presence at all.
The only way Simmons could be anything like the Mike Trout of the NBA would be if Trout averaged just 10 HR’s a year instead of 30. That plus being a .265 hitter for his career instead of a .305 hitter. Otherwise, a big no way.
When is the last time the Angels have been in Pennant contention? It hasn’t been since Trout made the big club.
It was more a shot at Trout being a star not ever playing in the playoffs rather than Simmons being the best player in basketball.
Curry, Klay and Draymond were born in 20th century
Wiseman, 7 and 14 were born in 21st century
21 – 20 = 1 century
Good by GSW’s Myers, not trying to combine winning with development… unless that is just this year’s smokescreen for the draft!
But I would consider the 7&14 available.
Why can’t you combine winning and development? The SF Giants are proving you can do both at the same time.
The Hawks are somewhat proving that wrong too, but they had bleak years and high picks. I’m sure there are other BB examples when draftees accumulate with stable veterans, but it is a risk to try intentionally.
GSW is not settled like a team set in its ways. They need a comeback but have many unanswered questions beyond PG. They should be “developing” vets into a team in Curry’s window. Of course the urgency for that declines when they get Curry into the contract they like…
Bob realizes the only way they got to the Finals was by developing players right? You can’t sustain 4 dudes putting you over the luxury by themselves each year. You need cheaper youthful talent along with that veteran core. Each team left was aided by young talent in round 2, except the Bucks.
True that the rookie-scalers are a good category to find the best cheap players but it is risky relying on that. This is a weird year with stars out, so being young is good.
Look-ups: Players that were young recently winning titles can hardly be called developmentals and the picture is even bleaker for youngsters before that (excepting Kawhi’s second year in 2014). “Juniors” Barnes, Draymond, & Siakim peaked fast and have not really gotten much better. “Soph” Anunoby has improved his PER by 5 but was not a starter and is average 15 still.
Moody, Kispert, and Wagner fit for GSW. If they got 2 if those 3 their 2nd unit should be in good shape.
Curry
Klay
Wiggins
Draymond
Looney
Lee
Poole
Kispert
Wagner
Wiseman
Barnes is a much better fit for the Warriors. Moody is preferable to Kispert, or Wagner. I’d pick Wagner over Kispert.
Barnes likely won’t be there at 7. And Moody may not be there at 14.
Moody disappeared on the big stage. Wonder how that’ll translate on the biggest stage in the NBA? Another guy with talent and the body and all the physical stuff but can’t get there mentally? He played in the SEC so hope for the best. I don’t think I would draft him if he was available even at 14 for the Warriors. Am I off base?
See him go 8 in 3 mocks, 10, 11, 12, 14, and 15 since the ping pong balls were drawn. So seems the consensus is he’s a lottery pick according to 8 mocks.
Yes Philly Ballers I’ve seen those same mock drafts. I’m just saying I wouldn’t pick him so high. Let someone else Pick him High. He’ll probably go very high but it better not be the Warriors at 14 and definitely not at 7. As the other guy said, oh HAIL NO !!
Yea I wouldn’t pick Moody at 7. Depends who is still there at 14 tho…. if you’re deciding between Moody, Kai Jones, Alperen Sengun, you’d probably go Moody unless you have someone else they are high on someone like Ziaire Williams.
Trade idea
Warriors get VanVleet and 4th pick
Raptors get Wiseman, 7, 14 and Oubre
Well Oubre is a free agent so unless you’re suggesting a sign and trade
I don’t think you can combine assets in a sign and trade, so that’s not possible either.
Yea I think it has to be a separate transaction and still has to work under the cap rules.
Other assets can be added to sign-and-trade deals — no rule against that. This trade from last fall is one example: link to hoopsrumors.com
Thank you Luke for clarifying.
Bob Myers sounds like Marty if he’s unwilling to risk losing to develop his young players. All they’re doing is delaying the inevitable and increasing the chances of turning Wiseman into a bust. His team isn’t going to turn back time and recreate the magic they had 5 years ago when the team won 73 games. Wake up from the fantasy.
Even with Klay Thompson back they will be lucky just to win 50 games next year.
They’re stuck in limbo with aging players from their championship days and the younger players are paying the price by not being allowed to develop their skills.
Yeah that Curry guy looks like he’s just about dead out there….way past his prime.
Huh? What are you babbling about? What players are they holding back? You are ignoring the coaching changes they just made. You are the one sounding more like Marty. Your homerism is rather delusional.
It’s because he and Marty are one of the same. They just don’t know it. Believe that’s called being a schizophrenic.
Warriors for the last 2 years grew players into their roles. Poole, JTA, and Lee became solid bench players. Now they add Thompson back, a #7 pick, and a #14 pick with Jessup coming over this year. Now you have a bench needing to add a center back up and a tall forward. So i do not understand the dead in water analogy because if they stay healthy they are automatically a playoff team.
Wally, this seasons winning percentage would result in 44 wins over 82 game schedule. No Klay. No Chriss. Minimal availability on Wiseman the number 2 pick. Kinda difficult to develop youngsters when they’re out with injuries (BTW, Poole =:young = DEVELOPING 6th man).Minimal availability of Oubre. Yet, 44 wins in a full season? 50 wins means six more? Without those injuries they only win 6 more? Marty care to chime in with Kerr whining here? A coach that loses that much talent can still win 44? He must really suck. I don’t post much here because I feel it’s OBVIOUS what a waste of my time it would be.
Simmons needs to go to a lottery team for a couple of seasons to find himself. It needs to be a team with no other dominant ball handler and a lot of shooting. Kings should consider trading Fox. They’re treading water as they are.
Yes, I’d trade Fox for Simmons
5 years $158 million for 4 years $147 million contract
Uh, NO !! Not Only No, but Hell No !!
Simmons and Milton for Wiggins, Paschall and the 14th pick.
Before you all say no way Draymond and Ben both can’t shoot blah blah blah.
Green is a career 32% 3P shooter, which is better than Ja Morant, DeAaron Fox and Caris LeVert were this year. So for a PF that averaged 9 assists per game last year and is a former DPOY he does alright.
And for those that say why would GSW do that Ben ain’t clutch blah blah blah
Ben in Philly was the point guard and second best player behind Embiid. He didn’t step up at all and that hurt his team but in GSW he wouldn’t have that pressure to score and create his own shots. He would also be playing off two of the best shooters and clutch scorers.
Why it would work? Firstly ball movement. Simmons (7), Green (9), and Curry (6) all pass the ball really well and that GSW style would work so well for Ben. They push the ball as quickly as possible up the court for easy buckets which also puts pressure on the opponent’s to get back quickly as less committed for offensive rebounds. In the half court they play off the back of Curry and Klay coming off screens for shots. Ben could either be a passer or screen setter, where he would create miss-matches and create easy buckets.
Secondly the defence would be great. Green is a former DPOY and is the local leader who directs teammates and can switch onto anyone. Ben was robbed of DPOY this year but can guard 1-5 and is great as an on ball defender. Klay is a good defender an Wiseman will develop into a good defender too.
GSW also have a great shooting coach and spending time with Curry and Klay, Ben could develop/improve his jumper. I think the culture and city of San Fran would suit Ben a lot more than Philly. Plus with Curry Klay and Green all in their 30’s they need to have some youth for the future to build around. Ben gives them a bright future and something they can build around.
As for my Sixers. Wiggins improved alot this season, his 3P% increased to 38% and his defence also improved alot. He contested the 12th most shots in the league and the most for a wing player. He was a former first overall pick and could still get better in Philly. He played previously with Joel Embiid in college where they both did well which means in the league they could co exist and okay together well.
We would also be getting Paschall who comes in and fills the back up power forward position we have struggled to fill recently. He would develop well behind Tobias Harris and learning from a big man like Embiid too. Then we also get the 14th overall pick in the draft to bring in some more young talent.
We then replace Ben with Kyle Lowry who wants to come home to Philly. He is an experienced leader that can shoot and provide some leadership on the court. He’s won a championship and that knowledge would be a huge asset for the young guys. Not to mention teams would have to defend our point guard better, they can’t just put a big on him like they did with Ben with will also make Embiids work easier and provide more space on the wings
But it’s worse for Philly than GSW, and Simmons is already gone, so no Lowry.
That makes no sense? What’s worse? Simmons is gone where? Why no Lowry ?
I love it. I’ll take Simmons on the Warriors all day long and twice on Sunday. The only concern would be duplication of Draymond Green but I think they can make it work. You stagger Simmons and green minutes a little bit and then their defense when both on the floor will be absolutely amazing.
I’m a firm believer that Andrew Wiggins has to be gone next year. Trade him after his best season. My opinion though, He’s not a fourth quarter basketball player.. and in the playoffs he’ll let you down. Simmons has his flaws but once he gets to San Francisco he’ll get straightened out, including his elbow when he shoots LOL.
Bottom line absolutely Andrew Wiggins has to be traded this offseason. Absolutely has to. HE CAN’T STAY WITH THE GOLDEN STATE WARRIORS.
Huh? Simmons is a PG; Green is a PF. Why do you want to get rid of Wiggins? He is not going anywhere.
“We then replace Ben with Lowery”
I guess you meant get him as a FA?— but how?— 6ers are way over the cap.
Note GSW fans liking the proposal… Wiggins will disappoint.
Have you really looked at Wiggins stats? He is not good at defense, despite what your cherry picked stat of shots contested makes you think. He is basically a maximum salary Kyle Kuzma. His PER is 15, literally the definition of league average. His DWS was 2.7, WS/48 of .08 (.100 is league average), his DBPM is -.6 and his VORP is .8…the guy is very average and makes the max. it’s a stretch to assume that because Wiggins and embiid played 1 season together in college 7 years ago that it would have any impact on the court in the nba
I would love to see Lowry in philly, but that’s not realistic unless he signs for the MLE. Otherwise the Sixers would need to work out a sign and trade for him, which would hard cap them at about $139 million. They have roughly 120 million committed to 9 players. That means they would still need to sign 4 or 5 players with 19 million, but how much of that 19 goes to Lowry. The number 14 pick will count 3 million, so that leaves 16 and Lowry still hasn’t gotten paid. They would probably have to trade curry to make the money work.
Did Maxey look good enough to hand him the starting role?
That’s a very interesting question. I love his game but I think he needs more time to develop and play in more control. I would run him as the 6th man next year and be the leader of the second unit before giving him the reins. The Sixers have title aspirations, and I don’t think that affords them the luxury of dealing with maxey’s growing pains in the starting lineup
Good post, i give no fox.
Wiggins was incredible on defense last season, last season is how we should view him moving forward, playing with Steph helped him find himself more – you would know this if you actually watched some games, maybe do that instead of writing essays next time?
It was a detailed response to the guy that has suggested trading Simmons for Wiggins in every single article that mentions either the Warriors or Simmons. Sorry if you do not agree with the stats. Incredible defense? You are such a homer. Here are some more stats from DPOY Wiggins…He allowed the 3rd most 2nd chance points in the league, behind defensive stalwarts buddy hield and Anthony edwards. He was bottom 20 in the league in points allowed in the paint. I am shocked he got the one vote he did get for 2nd team all defense. Perhaps you cast it
@Simmons > Russ
I like the analysis here, yes Simmons+Green+Splash Bros+Wiseman would be an instant contender, and Wiggins+Embiid might work better, along with Wiggins being a lights out shooter who also spaces and plays Simmons-level D, unlike Simmons – but I think GSW might be more inclined to trade the #7 pick if they can’t get Scottie Barnes with it, as they like a lot of those 8-15 options more and will have more players to get there, opposed to “Barnes or nothing” like they are indicating now.
Pacific Division is likely to repeat the championship?
Next year
All 4 best teams will be in Pacific Division
Suns – conference final
Clippers – conference final
Lakers defensive champ
Warriors – 3 championships
I don’t buy Hawks thing or Bucks thing
The Hawks might surprise you a little bit this year Sillivan….
If Warriors are not able to trade Wiseman and 2 picks, Warriors are 6-8 seed
If traded, Warriors are 3-5 seed
Davion Mitchell or Scottie Barnes will be available at 7 for sure
Huge drop off from 5 to 6?
I don’t think so.
If everything goes well for them they could be a 6-8 seed, only homers like Marty think the Warriors will be serious contenders. But after suffering two major injuries the last two years expecting Klay to be anywhere near 100% next season is absolutely ridiculous. Playing around 40 games is a very realistic goal for him to strive for in 2022, maybe 50 if he’s lucky.
As long as this team has Curry I won’t count them out. Your takes just aren’t it, chief.
The Warriors will not burn another year of Curry and keep their draft picks !!!
Unless they pull off a Jalen Suggs trade they have to dump Wiggins Wiseman and the two picks. Perhaps they keep one pick and draft a ready-made shooter like kispert.
Do I need to put this in all caps also? **They will not run it back and develop players.** Not sure which vet or two they can aquire but they’ll figure it out.
You posted before that Wiseman will be traded and I agree. They should be able to keep 7 pick and trade Wiseman and 14 shouldn’t they Gary. I’m not talking superstar quality but maybe a Bogut/Iguodala next level from superstar type. 7 could be a Draymond type. Thoughts Gary?
You posted before that Wiseman will be traded and I agree. They should be able to keep 7 pick and trade Wiseman and 14 shouldn’t they Gary. I’m not talking superstar quality but maybe a Bogut/Iguodala next level from superstar type. 7 could be a Draymond type. Thoughts Gary? P0
oops. not sure what happened there with the *PO*
The Warriors finish eighth and they didn’t really start playing until the second half when they finally told Curry just keep shooting. If Klay even comes back 80% and maybe they pick up one key vet and Poole and Paschall progress to shore up the second team, I think they could be an upper seed easily.
You might want to write this down and save it for later to impress your friends.
•James Wiseman traded.
•Andrew Wiggins traded.
•Some combination of their two draft picks traded.
Unless somebody is trading a top all star talent Wiseman and Wiggins are going nowhere. So far there is no all star on the market. Ignore the Simmons talk because GSW said they are not looking at him because they have Green who does the same.
Thing is, Wiggins (and Oubre) have to go if GSW is to bring in another high paid star – if you think they are going that route, then yes he’s getting moved. If you are team “stand pat, keep all picks, basically run this squad back” then yeah Wiggins stays. Either situations are valid.
“So far there is no all star on the market.” yes, its the playoffs, its not considered classy to blow up teams while games are still being played and many teams avoid this. Have you paid attention to the NBA? It’s the most “Holy cr@p!!” offseasons in pro sports, there ABSOLUTELY will be many all-stars on the market this offseason! Teams change direction at the top at the drop of a hat, and GSW will have dozens upon dozens of options this offseason. If they pull any moves off remains to be seen, but to act like every team in the NBA will stay course and keep all players happy is extraordinarily low. Just saying.
@GaryWarriorsRedSox
What if they kept everyone though? Adding Klay to that mix might be enough if they draft no Wiseman “project” types and instead find the high-IQ, ready-now Haliburton-esque players in this draft, which there are several.
I am on the fence here, on one hand I’d love to see everyone but the big 3+JTA turned over to surround Steph with the best possible players for his new prime, which is the most exciting thing to do here, but also running everyone back + the two picks + Klay might be enough if Klay comes back to his normal or even better than that, like KD just did.
No, it wasn’t “told Curry just keep shooting” it was Kerr refusing to run the PNR even though it meant instant buckets for Steph. Once he started running them, Steph took off.
Why would the Kings trade a shooter and a lottery pick for a guard who doesn’t shoot the ball? And can’t make free throws. How has he not improved his shooting? What does he do in the off-season. No to Simmons!
Ayton is great he’s just not flashy hence less attention.
Somehow Ayton got stars in his eyes and started playing with joy, which helps jumping competitively (a lesson from volleyball!). He credited the arrival of certain veterans. This is how a GM makes a difference to players. The atmosphere became positive.
Thing is, he did not used to be great or even very good, and so created a bad impression. He is flashier!— or at least tv likes to mic him up. Starting to remind me of David West… but taller, less tricky.
Anyone think Aston will get a Max extension? I feel like he thinks he’s a Max Player, but that it’s unwise to max him. 4/80 type of contract seems more in line.
He will get the max. Centers always take much longer to develop into all stars. Embiid took a few years too. Aston will only get better because now he knows he can dominate.
Joel was injured for 2 years, you saw he was a Max player as soon as he stepped on the court. He was averaging 20 and 7 on 25 minutes his first season.
Ayton has a lot more around him than Embiid did. So it would deflate his value. Maybe 4/80 is light – that’s what Bridges would probably get. 4/100 probably is more in-line. A lot of guys get Max deals that shouldn’t (Ben Simmons).
Wny not trade Curry and Draymind this offseason ? It will be a risk either way!
Zach Lowe on his podcast discussed a James Wiseman+#7+#14 for Cade Cunningham aka #1 and Jonathan Givony said Detroit loves Wiseman and envision running him with Plumlee as twin towers immediately, with Plumlee eventually passing the torch to Wiseman as the primary big. This might have legs??
Warriors might be able to get #2 from Houston for those 3 assets, but not #1.