Even if the Jazz decide to trade Donovan Mitchell, the Knicks might not be first in line to acquire him, writes Ian Begley of SNY.tv. A New York City native, Mitchell has been rumored as a prime Knicks target for some time. The Jazz have indicated they plan to keep Mitchell and rework the roster around him, but sources tell Begley that several teams believe he would be available at the right price.
However, there’s no guarantee that New York’s front office will meet that price. Sources close to the Knicks indicated to Begley before the draft that the team was reluctant to part with the mix of players and draft picks that would be necessary to land a talent like Mitchell, fearing that the remaining roster would be too thin to compete. Since then, New York has reached an agreement with free agent guard Jalen Brunson, but Begley doesn’t believe that will change the team’s philosophy toward a potential Mitchell trade.
There’s more from New York:
- The Knicks may have signed their top target this year by luring Brunson away from the Mavericks, but it’s still not clear that team president Leon Rose was the best choice to run the organization, per Stefan Bondy of The New York Daily News. Rose and William Wesley were highly touted when they took over the Knicks because of their connections to the league’s top players. The results have been uninspiring, according to Bondy, as the team hasn’t landed a true star and has committed nearly $500MM in guaranteed money over the past two summers to an average roster.
- Brunson’s father, Knicks assistant coach Rick Brunson, has been telling friends for months that Jalen wanted to come to New York, but there were concerns about whether the team could create enough cap space to make a competitive offer, tweets Marc Berman of The New York Post. The Brunson family has a strong connection to Rose, but Jalen wasn’t willing to sign for less than his market value.
- The Knicks may have dodged a bullet when Kevin Durant and Kyrie Irving decided to sign with Brooklyn three years ago, suggests Steve Popper of Newsday. The Knicks pursued the two stars, but Popper believes they would have run into the same chaos the Nets are experiencing now.
I’m sure every player is available for the right price. My guess is that the Jazz do their retooling this Summer around Donovan and then reevaluate before the trade deadline and again next Summer. That’s the soonest I’d see Donovan ever getting traded.
Why? For example, I think Donovan likes NY in the off-season but probably finds it too distracting during the season. He’s the type that likes to focus on basketball when he’s trying to win. You saw how distracted he was during the Mavs vs. Jazz series with everyone talking about him or Rudy. Amplify that times 82 and he’d get burned out in NY. Fun to visit but not to live there. The same could be said about Miami and all the distractions there.
I’m hoping Ainge does same thing with Mitchell as he did with Pierce, ship everyone off and build the team around Mitchell then win a championship.
Although, one rumor I’ve heard is 4x 1st round picks, 3 pick swaps, and RJ Barrett for Donovan Mitchell. RJ is only 22 and bigger than DM. He’s not as good of a big time scorer as Donovan, but he would fit better in my ideal situation where every position is athletic and long.
The only other concern about RJ is he doesn’t seem to have much fire. Then again, that could also mean he’s just a calm, cold killer.
If the Jazz were thinking about a rebuild then this could be the right move. Ainge did something similar in Boston and now they’re knocking on the door of a championship. Just have to be patient, if you’re a Jazz fan. =^)
Knicks trade for Durant, Irving and Mitchell
Lakers also wanted all of them
So why are we accumulating draft picks if we aren’t going to trade them to upgrade the roster? Are we just going to save them so we can attach them to bad contracts? We didn’t burn any for Ivey or Murray and now not Mitchell either. I don’t even want Mitchell but I can at least understand going after him. He’s a young star…it would make sense. I wish I could see a strategy, even one I didn’t agree with. I see nothing.
Remember the last time the Knicks chased a young star at 26 named Carmelo Anthony?
Knicks should be building a well rounded roster right now not chasing a star via trade that will sacrifice young players and picks.
Knicks have holes to fill.
They got a PG finally in Brunson but they really need a 3 and D sf and more reliable bench depth. Could also use more depth at center. Hassan Whiteside would be a good get for depth.
Is throwing 100+ million at Jalen really building a well rounded roster? While I agree that having 2-3 stars on your team with no depth is no longer a viable option in the NBA you need high quality players and this FO hasn’t been able to trade for them and definitely hasn’t ID’d them in free agency (hence last season). I think they massively over payed for Brunson as well. Thibs doesn’t play rookies…what are you doing with all those picks if you aren’t trading them for a star. I don’t think Mitchell takes gutting the roster + all your picks but I could be proven wrong. Not to mention who on this Knicks team would you not be willing to trade because they are a slam dunk all-star?
Brunson is coming off a run to the WCF where he was the 2nd best player averaging 21.6ppg on a .446/.347/.800 slash. He’s also now the 14th highest paid PG in the league and I think we can all agree that’s he’s at least above average.
We also know you can’t attract superstar free agents without a solid structure in place. This gives them two good players in Brunson and Barrett in place with many solid role players, draft assets, and contracts of varying values to trade for that superstar if you can’t sign one.
Agreed (at least on superstar point) – that’s the point here though right, if Mitchell is available you need to at least try and get him. Why else have you been gathering assets. And if it costs Barrett + a bunch of picks I still think you have to pull the trigger IMO. But Barrett also confuses me as to the kind of player he ends up.
The only thing I would say is the Knicks felt the same way last off-season hen they spent too much on players that weren’t great…Fornier being prime example 1A. You don’t sign a player due to a postseason run. That’s generally not a great plan and paying due to small sample…Obi crushed it the last 2+ weeks of the season with Randle…doesn’t mean I am doling out a huge contract to him (understanding level of competition is different so not apples to apples but I think the general point still resonates).
Knicks need to completely tear down to be quite honest. Theyre not anywhere close to being contenders and trading for someone like Mitchell doesn’t improve those odds significantly. Brunson and Mitchell aren’t leading the Knicks past Celtics Bulls Raptors 76ers Heat Hawks possibly Cavs
Use least valuable picks to unload Fournier or ride out the contract.
Trade Randle for picks and see what you have in Toppin
And overhaul their scouting department.
Clear cap room.
Thibs plays rookies and young players if that’s what you give him. If your expectation is compete coaches are going to play players looking to compete. If your expectation is draft develop earn your bones then you’ll see younger players getting more time.
Knicks have absolutely no idea what they’re doing and what they’re building towards.
I agree with building a well rounded roster but that’s not what they’re doing. They seem to be checking boxes every year. We need shooting, let’s over pay for an average player in Fournier, we need a point guard, let’s pickup an aging broken star and then not play him, we need a younger star, let’s try to make Randle into one and then draft his replacement AND THEN NOT PLAY HIM. We gather picks, OK, I love picks, but when it comes time to draft we trade back for more lesser quality picks instead of bundling them up to try to draft a stud. Ok, we must be prepping for a big trade, then you get an article like this saying they don’t want to give up too many of them for a star. WHERES THE STRATEGY. Now we do have a checked box at every roster position, got our point guard, yup. I like Brunson, just not that much. But our cap is gone and we won’t trade any picks unless it’s to get rid of contracts. There’s the point, I think we’ve painted ourselves into a corner with a mediocre roster and I’m not sure there’s a solid plan for improvement.
Knicks didn’t chase him. The media and the Owner did. In the end The Owner does what ha wants. That why we are who we are since Ewing left.
The extra picks they have aren’t spectacular (they’re protected ) so you mix those in with some of your own unprotected and you got a deal assuming Utah wants a pick based package w decent expiring’s/decent young kids – Id do it theoretically if Im the Knicks and it were that simple (and it might be) but…..
My worries – Are DM Brunson RJ a bit tooo redundant? And does that even matter as much as we think today with position less basketball?
The redundancy question doesn’t matter, Jazz would want RJ to be part of the package for Mitchell.
Shesssh
Donovan Mitchell for Evan Fouriner (salary matching) RJ Barrett, Cam Reddish, and a bunch of first round picks.
Knicks at this stage have 4 first next year. I’d unload all 4 to the Jazz, take the hit and get over it.
Big 3 of Brunson Spida Randle.
This Knick FO was hired for its connections to players at all levels. But nobody (with a brain) believed that meant that FAs were going to take less than market value to sign with them. Connections give you the information and access that are the lifeblood of all recruiting. But even there, you need to have something to sell, in place, to be a true destination, and that takes time or luck.
It’s too early to judge this FO overall. But on the “connections” front, they shown well. At least as well as the market has allowed them to show. This year, without a destination team in place, they still signed the best UFA that will change teams this year. Last year, if they wanted him, they could have had DeRozan (the top FA that changed teams last year). That’s all connections get you. Mostly about true FAs. Players demanding trades still require assets to acquire, and there doesn’t appear to be much discount based on being on their list.
You can absolutely judge a FO that:
– doesn’t make an offer of Mitch, #8, and a future swap to the Warriors (negotiate it out) to jump CHA for Lamelo in ’20 (drafting a dynamic PG has a higher value than a rim running big without a dynamic PG)
– drafts a PF in the mid-lottery (forgoing a PG) in ’20
– extends a PF in ’21 (for fear of his price going up in 10 months, after you already drafted at his position 14 months earlier…)
– signs a few over-market contracts in the summer of ’21
– tries to offload a few of those very contracts in Feb ’22; fail to do so
– trades for a player, then allows the coach to bury him on the roster (an FO should have metrics they need to assess in live competition; you assume (hope) they saw something to make the trade in the first place..)
– trade assets to rid the books of some of those contracts in the summer of ’22;
“Connections” tho.
All I’ve seen so far is more cronyism at MSG.
Let’s start with a cogent strategy that will play well against the maneuvers of other NBA FOs.
I agree with so much of this. I think the biggest mistake was bringing in Thibs and trying to win in year one with him. Imagine if they traded rather than extended Randle. The player development hasn’t been spectacular either (I mean IQ is Fine and Obi shows flashes but both are nearly redundant on a team with Randle and other non-shooting PG). Wil be interesting to see if Thibs can adjust and use his whole roster this season.
True. But I got my doubts about Thibs. Willing to admit I’m wrong, but he has to show it.
I think Randle should be gone, it’s obvious that Obi Toppin works harder and is absolutely a Human highlight film,don’t believe it Google him. Thibs handling of Obi was criminal, with all the inefficientcy of Julius we lost games we should have won. Julius was a bad defensive player also, he wasn’t getting back and he was allowing shooters to go by.He also had 3.5 turnovers a game and shot 30.8 from 3. Julius was fined $120000 last season offended the fans and quit with 11 games left, called hamstring,but his last game he scored 9 points the Knicks won but Julius left the team on the court! Julius needs to go and allow Obi to become the player he has ability to be.
@4Quarters – Your post is comical. E.g., the FO sucks because you believe they didn’t make a trade up offer three drafts ago (even though you just dreamed up the offer, and really have no idea what they did or didn’t offer to trade up). They, in your mind, signed above market contracts during a free agency period (which is something only a 2k’er can believe). Etc. FYI, Randle was offered the 20% extension because the only coherent alternative was to trade him. 30 out of 30 teams do one of those two things (offer an extension or trade the guy). I get that a 2k’er wouldn’t understand that.
Like any FO, they’ve had their share of misses, but that’s to be expected, and – yes – it’s too soon make any kind of final judgement (at least for those who’s judgement has any credibility).
You can’t write a coherent post, how would you know if the FO has a coherent strategy?
Ok DXC, you got it…
If the Knicks offered anything to trade up in 2020, point me in the direction of the report detailing it. Might take you some time, so just drop the link here whenever…if ever.
There’s no point in saying anything about last year’s contracts. They were not good. You can’t even come up with a reason why/how they were. Just trying to be a straight up contrarian. Fine if that’s how you wanna play it lol
Consider me fully aware of the 20% extension Randle got (as opposed to UFA the next (this) summer). Next, show me examples of non-contenders choosing to offer that extension to a player who plays the same position as the person said team selected in the lottery the prior year?
Won’t even get into the minutiae of competent roster construction, weighing the risks of positional fit vs [whatever reason the Knicks took Toppin]
“Sources close to the Knicks indicated to Begley before the draft that the team was reluctant to part with the mix of players and draft picks that would be necessary to land a talent like Mitchell, fearing that the remaining roster would be too thin to compete.”
So, the Carmelo situation all over again. Hopefully, the Knicks learned something. But then again, James Dolan is still at the helm.
So your point relies on Melo and “sources close”?
Knix are loaded with picks, and they have salary to be upgraded by Mitchell. What is the point to picks, but finding a Mitchell?
You do realize that quote I used was taken directly from the article (?)
Yes, but the source is several steps away. The article (Arthur Hill) sounded skeptical of the excuse’s merit, suggesting that using these can’t-miss assets were used for Brunson anyway.
Knix have a lot of draft equity still, too.
The Knix have a lot of chefs in the kitchen, and they will all have a reason why/why not.
Here’s the problem … who was the last nba champion that didn’t have a top 5-10 player superstar? So while I agree with the whole not gutting your roster for a superstar philosophy, I also realize that you can’t win without a superstar either. If we could get Mitchell for picks and guys like Fournier to match salary, I think that would be the best chance we have to be a title contender.
If you can keep Randle, who many fans don’t like you’d have a top 5 PF and a top 5 SG in Spida. Brunson is a solid young point guard than has been improving. DRose has been one of the best contributors off the bench for the past few season. Mitchell Robinson has been resigned he’s a solid rim protecting centre.
It would be the best looking Knicks side in a very long time.
I’m guessing the deal would look something like RJ Barrett, Evan Fouriner, Cam Reddish and 4 first round picks. Which considering you have 4 first next year isn’t an insane amount to give up.
Jazz would be happy, bunch of vets they can flip for extra picks or young players. RJ Barrett as they can build around for now. Then a combined 10 first round picks from Mitchell and Gobert.
It seems like not making even the play-in is no big deal to these guys and they think they don’t need to make real changes. Not trading Burks at the deadline last season, for instance, and then paying DET to take him shows they’re not dealing with reality. Although they have some talent in the FO it may be that Rose/Thibs Inc. make the final decisions and the FO are not all on the same page. Reddish is a great example of this, really head scratching like this year’s Draft mess.
Spot on.
To me, the disconnect starts with the Randle/Toppin situation. There should have been convo throughout the FO on Randle’s future with the team, then a final deterministic decision:
If he’s def going to be moved, draft Toppin if he’s #1 on their board at that pick.
If Randle either is definitely not going to be moved, or maybe he might be moved.. it’s undecided – fill the point guard talent void, either by trading up for Lamelo, taking best one available/trading back to get him if #8 is too high, or shop the pick for worthwhile PGs. After all of that is exhausted – then take Toppin if he’s still the best option; but, an adjustment is needed because there’s a pooling of assets at a non-premium position.
What makes absolutely no sense is both drafting Toppin in the lottery and 14 months later extending the person blocking him.
That’s a 2K “oh shiii I could give out extensions now!!” move.
You must not keep up with us. So let me catch you up, free of charge. Toppin was drafted cause Randle was being shopped. But then Thibs came in. And Randle was his reclamation project. He responded with best yr ever. A historic yr by stats for a PF. (you can look it up).
So the trade was off. And they built a team off their defense. Good enough for 4th seed and coach of year and comeback player of the year.
Then it turns out Randle is soft. Had his feelings hurt last yr. So he sulked thru the yr. That plus injuries gave them a 37-45 season. So here we are ……..
Randle is not going to be part of this team. Only Thibs can keep him here. And he may go with him in the end. NYC has had it with Soft Randle.
I think Randle should be gone, it’s obvious that Obi Toppin works harder and is absolutely a Human highlight film,don’t believe it Google him. Thibs handling of Obi was criminal, with all the inefficientcy of Julius we lost games we should have won. Julius was a bad defensive player also, he wasn’t getting back and he was allowing shooters to go by.He also had 3.5 turnovers a game and shot 30.8 from 3. Julius was fined $120000 last season offended the fans and quit with 11 games left, called hamstring,but his last game he scored 9 points the Knicks won but Julius left the team on the court! Julius needs to go and allow Obi to become the player he has ability to be.
Do you have a problem with JR offending the fans?
Interesting, I quite like a star player with the guts to stand up against the “so called” fans!
The clown media strikes again. These are the same guys who killed Knicks for not signing KD and Kyrie ??????
Why would they sign with a team with NO talent…… But let’s write it anyway. Espn ran it for yrs. How we couldn’t sign them. No one here cares about the truth. Knicks sucked. Why would anyone sign with them.
CLOWNS …..….. all a Clown act.
It’s been two lousy yrs. For this FO and this coach. Why is everyone on NY time here. Any other franchise gets 5 yrs to rebuild. Relax and smoke a blunt ….. do t fall for the clown act.
Knicks have plenty of picks. They have young talent. They took a step back last yr. (noted). That doesn’t mean we can’t take 2-3 steps forward this yr.
Finally got a real staring PG. But nobody talks about our DEPTH at PG NOW.
Rose, Quickley, McBride ….. DEPTH
So after two yrs NY media and its cult followers want to kill us.
So We’ll try your best. You got words and we got GAME.
Those picks aren’t there to talk about. They will be used for right move. It’s smart to wait it out. Nobody expected KD to want out. There will be a player out there for us. Just gotta be 27 and under.
Next yrs draft is deep. So with all our picks we can move up and get another nice player. Stop swallowing the media juice. There is a trade coming this yr. I just pray Randle is involved. NYK