The Jazz are high on Knicks wing RJ Barrett and were “pushing” for him to be included in a potential trade for Donovan Mitchell, writes Tony Jones of The Athletic. Prior to agreeing to an extension, sources tell Jones that Barrett’s camp was “bracing” for the 22-year-old to be dealt away.
The extension will make including Barrett in a deal extremely difficult due to the “poison pill provision,” though the possibility reportedly remains. As Yossi Gozlan of HoopsHype explains, the Jazz don’t have the necessary cap space or a trade exception big enough to absorb Barrett’s incoming salary, so for him to be included, a third team would likely have to be involved for salary-matching purposes.
As Steve Popper of Newsday writes, not everyone in the Knicks organization viewed Barrett as being worth $107MM over four years ($120MM with incentives), and others thought including him in a proposal for Mitchell might make the Jazz less likely to ask for additional draft compensation, which obviously wasn’t the case.
In addition to Barrett, Utah also values second-year guard Quentin Grimes and third-year forward Obi Toppin, according to Jones, who notes that both young players will likely have to part of the trade package if Barrett is not. However, New York has been “very hesitant” to part with Grimes to this point, sources tell Jones.
Like Marc Berman of The New York Post, both Popper and Jones hears the Knicks are still optimistic about landing Mitchell, but as with Grimes, Jones says they have been reluctant to include a “significant number” of unprotected first-round picks because they want to keep their options open for the future.
Jones still views the Knicks and Jazz as the most logical trade partners for Mitchell, but writes that both teams have questions that need answered first. Popper views Mitchell as a questionable fit with Jalen Brunson, and thinks the Knicks shouldn’t trade away all of their own unprotected first-rounders to land him.
According to Adam Zagoria of NJ.com, Mitchell removed the Jazz from his Twitter bio on Tuesday, fueling speculation about the trade talks.
Jazz would’ve gotten Barrett grimes toppin quickley and 6 unprotected if it was the older regimes
They weren’t going to get that ever.
If Isaiah Thomas was still running the Knicks, it would’ve. He would have included like five 2nd rounders that the Jazz didn’t even ask for, too.
These teams trying to trade away all their players for a star. I laugh at this. This would be a HORRIBLE trade for the Knicks and I value Mitchell quite highly. They just added their beloved Brunson, who will take over ball handling duties once they acquire Mitchell.. we know randle loves his touches too.
Brunson got paid because of what he showed playing 2nd fiddle to Luka. Mitch being the primary ball handler would benefit the Knicks tremendously. As for JR… maybe less touches is good thing
I hadn’t really thought about Mitchell Robinson playing point for them, but I’m intrigued.
Lol
Mitchell is good but no way he is worth 6 or 7 picks and a bunch of young players that could turn into future all -stars.
The first problem is that Brunson was beloved. You simply can’t come out of free agency, land that guy and be like ‘we won’.
Finally someone says that. The Knicks win 5 more games max. Closer to lose. Any number of players are reporting to a locker room thats not there. They have been outside waiting to be shipped. That’s not going away. It effects ones game.
I’m a Knicks fan, can someone please tell me why Grimes is being valued as a can’t miss prospect?
He’s a prototypical 3 and D player. Extremely valued in the modern NBA. That’s his floor. His ceiling could be an efficient 15 PPG scorer with the aforementioned D. Those players are valued around 15m a year, and he’s playing on a rookie contract.
But to refuse to give him up in a trade for Mitchel ? There are a lot of 3 and D guys.
And plus, if he stays, he’s barely gonna get any grind out there. If Thibs has him playing more than 20 minutes, that would be shocking.
I think they’ll include him push come to shove. Argument may be more along the lines of, “We think Grimes is a really good prospect, so instead of giving you the 5 picks you want, we only want to give you 4, and increase the protections on 1 as well.”
He could easily turn into Kris Middleton as his ceiling. People are selling Grimes short.
He’s the next Michael Jordan, already better than LeBron.
Middleton 6’7, he hitting a growth spurt?
Me.
Someone explain to me why this complicates the trade. Barrett’s poison pill provision would mean the Jazz would have to take on 26 million in cap space to take on Barrett, Toppin makes $4 million. Mitchell’s contract is 30 million. Barrett+Toppin = 30 million just take Fournier out of the equation?
If the Jazz insist on Grimes just swap Toppin out for Grimes and Sims, McBride or Quickley.
I suggest reading Gozlan’s full article, he explains it pretty well. Essentially, Barrett’s outgoing salary for the Knicks is $10.9MM, so they’d have to include an additional $13.3MM to match Mitchell’s $30.35MM salary. But for the Jazz, Barrett’s incoming salary is $26.2MM, and including another $13.3MM on top of that would make the trade illegal for salary-matching purposes (the most they can take back is $38MM, per Gozlan).
The Knicks would be taking back too much salary in that scenario. Salary matching for both teams comes into effect because they would both be over the cap in any trade permutations. There’s a way to get it to work if the Knicks and Jazz add more money to the deal, but it’s less complicated to just involve a 3rd and or 4th team.
Knicks valuing Grimes way too highly when the reality is that if he stays put, under Thibs, he’s only going to play 23 games next season averaging 8 minutes a game.
While Brunson, Barrett, and Randle will be top 3 in minutes played.
I’ve been a Knicks fan for almost 2 decades now. I love that the new FO is trying to change the dynamic but they’re slowly trending to what the old FO use to do, miss out on the top free agents and pay a Brunson, a Randle 25-30 million a year. Then draft horribly every single draft.
People criticized them drafting Porzingis. He then proved he belonged and exceeded expectations. But they thought they were getting Zion, KD, and kyrie one off-season so they had to trade all the horrible contracts they gave out to role players they overvalued and had to attach porzingis to do so, only to once again flop during free agency.
Being a fan of this organization has been frustrating.
2017 draft, you have Michael Porter fall to you, they decided to draft the great Kevin Knox. I get that Porter only fell that badly because of the injury. But then again you draft the youngest player in the draft in Knox knowing you’re not going to compete for a playoff run any time soon so why not draft porter even missing a year?
Not even going to get into everything wrong about drafting Frank from France.
The most frustrating draft, the team hasn’t had a solid point for years, Haliburton falls to you, you need a point guard! Yet you pass up on him to draft the New York kid, Obi Toppin, who will be blocked by Randle.
Randle has one good year, they get excited and overpay him.
You have one of the most out of touch coaches in the entire nba. Guy seems to have a 6 sometimes 7 man rotation. Plays his “star” players 40 minutes a game. Knicks could have the number one prospect and Thibs would play him for 25 games, 12 minutes a game.
In a perfect world, the Knicks would have traded Randle and Evan ForgetsHowToPlay to the lakers for Westbrook. Not sign Brunson.
See what Westbrook can do for one season.
Give Toppin the starting 4 position he deserves.
A starting 5 of
Westbrook
IQ or Grimes at the 2
Barrett
Toppin
Robinson
That would be entertaining. Keep all your draft picks. Give your young guys a chance to show what they got.
I just … can you tell how frustrating being a Knicks fan is?
Finally a realistic and logical Knicks fan. Completely agree with your assessment of this franchise now and moving forward. Not a thibs fan though as I believe in the long term will stunt the growth of young core.
That’s just not as good of a team as they have now, and with way less flexibility to make the team better. Randle isn’t really overpaid. He obviously had a down year compared to how awesome he was the previous year, but last year was still probably his third best year as a pro. No point in trading him after a down year. Hopefully he rebounds and is somewhere in between his best season, and what he did last year. I do agree that Thibs isn’t the best fit for this team. At the very least, the young players should get more minutes, and he’s never been the type of coach to balance the present and future, which has to be a priority for the Knicks right now.
My problem with Randle was his court demeanor last year when things went bad on the court. His value to me suffered. The Knicks have young talent, love toppin, Grimes is a future star, got to give cam minutes, barret improved his game leaps and bounds last season. You dont mortgage for one player,in my opinion.
Strongly agree the recent lottery picks have just not been good overall
Agree Thibs is probably not the right coach given this team’s timeline
Disagree Randle was an overpay, although I wouldn’t be shedding tears if they hadn’t extended him (obviously)
Strongly disagree that there’s any value is seeing what Russ potentially has left in the tank this season
There is no need to tell us. The last 25 years have not been kind to them. Larry Johnsons 4 point play is still the biggest one they have had in the last 25 years.
My personal view is that Utah really wanted Barrett in the Mitchell deal. The Knicks were using that as leverage to get a deal done quickly and more on there terms.
Utah can afford to wait. If the Knicks don’t play well to start the season, they will be forced to deal on Utah’s terms.
Knicks must show results now, and are “married” to Jalen Brunson. Don’t see how the Knicks have “improved” this offseason. Losses early in the season will force change.
Brooklyn, Milwaukee, Boston, Miami, Philadelphia, Cleveland Chicago and Atlanta are all better teams right now. Ouch!
I like Grimes a lot. And truly believe he will be a starter one day. Considering he plays same position as Mitchell. Well he’s gotta go. And I’d rather keep Obi1. Knicks have to find a way. To make Randle a part of this trade.
You really struggle to understand basketball. Do you even watch games?
Thibs is a lead defensive assistant. But there are only 15 true NBA coaches in the league!
Wondering if the Knicks did the RJ contract now in order to remove him from trade discussions and force the Jazz to take what’s available.
I’m dismayed at a couple of things. First, the Knicks hesitation to move draft picks that have protections, or even their own considering they intend to not be a lottery team for quite some time if making this deal. Second, the Knicks trying to hold onto Grimes when he’d see very little time, especially if he’d be behind Mitchell. Barely 20 minutes a game, if that much. Toppin won’t see much time either considering they can’t move Randle. I say move Grimes, Toppin, McBride, and 5 picks for Mitchell. Starting group of Brunson, Mitchell, Barrett, Randle, and Robinson, with Rose, IQ, Fournier, Reddish, Simms, and Hartenstein as the bench. Improvement? Absolutely. Top tier? Not yet.
Knicks: Donovan Mitchell and Rudy Gay
Jazz: Russ, Toppin, Grimes, Christie and 4 firsts (3 unprotected)
Lakers: Evan Fouriner, Bojan Bogdanovic, Cam Reddish and a protected first (form the Knicks)
Jazz get the type of package they want. Big expiring deal, 3 young players and a bunch of picks. Knicks get the guy they want and compromise to give up Grimes and instead keep 2 picks from their original offer.
Lakers get rid of Russ for a haul of players which make them a better team.
Win for all teams involved.
Although I don’t like Mitchell’s fit in NY with Brunson RJ and Randle, it’s a good price to pay for an elite talent.
Jazz buy out Russ, Knicks might make a move or two (I’d trade Randle) and the Lakers sign Schroder and Tristan Thompson.
Knicks should then go RJ Barrett for OG Anunoby.
Then bring back Melo for a retirement season.
Knicks:
Brunson Donovan OG Randle Robinson
Rose IQ Melo Gay Hartenstein
McBride Keels Sims
Lakers:
Beverly Fouriner Bron AD Bryant
Schroder Walker Reddish Bojan Thompson
Nunn Reaves JTA Jones
Lakers have a really strong side capable of a deep playoff run. Knicks have a good amount of talent but still trying to make it all work together. Melo back in NY would be cool and that culture with Donovan leading the ship would be cool. Think Knicks would be a playoff squeeze in that would improve over time
Cam Christie in the deal? Really???? Lol. He is awful! Clearly has a good agent to get a 2-year, guaranteed minimum deal. It will be the only NBA $$$$ he ever see’s.
The Jazz say no.
The lakers get Fournier (negative asset), reddish (positive), Bojan (positive) and a 1st (positive) for Westbrook and Christie? Why do the jazz or knicks need LA to get involved if all they are putting on the table is the worst contract in the league and an end of bench player?
Let Mitchell go. It’s not happening.
There’s conflicting reports on whether the Jazz have ever wanted RJ. They didn’t want to extend him on a huge contract. Now all of sudden they want him? Isn’t that a large contract for a decent player?
I could, however, see the Lakers wanting him as part of a 3-team deal. Guess we’ll see soon enough, assuming a deal ever gets done.
Yawn
The elephant in the room is Randle. He’s a toxic influence who needs to go. He can okay his style of basketball in China.